Ive had it for about 1.5 yrs now and because its not painful and really just a small bump Ive not bothered with it until last fall when I saw a local general surgeon about it and scheduled the surgery for May as I go away in the winter. Mesh has become widely adopted because it decreases recurrence rates of hernias, not due to concerns about chronic pain. From the research Ive done, nearly 70 hours of it; Shouldice offers distinct advantages over mesh repair in the following ways: 1) No concern from implant of foreign object; ie fear of allergic reaction to mesh, worry of mesh erosion over the decades and nerve damage caused by mesh. The typical Shouldice patient only experience s 5 days of required recovery time after their surgery, while hernia patients from other institutions typically experience 10 days of recovery time. (2) do you know of the desarda method of no mesh surgery? Hello Justin. That is tough. To the wife of the husband with the augurales hernia. Mesh or the Shouldice method? One patient told me he didnt want to go back to Shouldice with his recurrence because he couldnt afford it. That is not my opinion, it is just a proven over and over medical fact. I went into general surgery because its well, general. Groin hernia repair is a day surgery procedure in Ontario (anywhere but the Shouldice clinic) with no overnight stay required, unless complications arise or in very frail or sick patients. I had little to no pain 4 days after the surgery, and other than a small scar, my groin has been perfect. Now patients will generally think that more care is better care. The first time I was sick with a high white blood cell count and they send me back home this was 5 years ago, 3 years ago I tried again and this time I had diabetes and they told me to go back home on the day of the surgery because I was coughing too much, the reason I was coughing was because of Ramipril a HBP medication. I also read that portion with more issues with smaller females, which worried me as Im only 53 and 117 lbs. My experience was extremely positive and I would not hesitate to return there. I still feel very comfortable with my decision to use the Shouldice clinic. (Wait time "explodes" the closer utilization gets to 100%! In a socialized model of healthcare, allowing some hospitals and surgeons to absolve themselves of this emergency work is unfair and leads to their claiming to have better outcomes. Shouldice Inguinal Hernia Repair Post-op Instructions Surgery You have just undergone surgery to repair an inguinal hernia. By the way, my sister is an RN at HHS who recommended Shouldice from what a Doc recommended to her. The facilities are dated, the food horrible, and you may not get the surgeon that assesses you. .1st operation to save my life. Also billing data was used for the study, which is a notoriously inaccurate way to study surgical outcomes. 4. shouldice offers a 4 day vacation. Placed in a room with patient who had surgery the day prior. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/15243743/ Less with lap but google complications of lap inguinal hernia repairs and you wouldnt touch it with a barge pole. At this stage I cannot guage the quality or durability of the underlying repair. I have to say, the experience was excellent. They told me they were being charged much less at Shouldice than they would have paid out of insurance in the US. Youll be able to walk out of the operating room and, by the next morning, youll start a well-structured and supervised exercise routine. Many of the patients in my cohort were from the US, one had driven over 2000 km to get the surgery. Sadly once you get the mesh and have issues with it the medical community doesnt know what to do. No kidding Shouldice will have better results than me when they do not have to operate on an obese diabetic at midnight who is dying from a piece of blocked gangrenous bowel in his hernia which they wouldnt fix electively because he was too heavy! Abstract. 1. shouldice offers reliable hernia repairs, with few relapses. First scheduled patients moved to pre-surgery prep. At this point I am out $980.00, I am more sore than I was at the same time following two mesh repairs, the in-hospital conditions/regimen were not as conducive to recovery as being at home. Therefore, it would be more destructive to attempt to accommodate greater numbers of patients at the expense of the quality of either care or facilities. In assessing them, serious consideration has to be given to the culture of the organization and the importance of preserving it in a service delivery system. However, it is also undeniable that the chance of a hernia recurring over time is reduced when mesh is utilized appropriately and on the right patient. Not that hard to understand why their academic achievements are always lower than private ones. The expertise of Shouldice seems hopeful and promising, and Im out of alternatives. I have just been chastised online for daring to criticize the Shouldice clinic on Twitter. . I had an inguinal (opposite side) and umbilical hernia repairs done using mesh two years ago. Ill take my chances with mesh next time all day long. I was told my mesh was new but found that it hasnt changed much since 2009 when Bard first came out with this polypropylene mesh. I would like to request if you please could comment on about the Desarda technique. Long initial waits for assessment, then flows like a manufacturing process. We know how to fix recurrence, but fixing mesh complications is a difficult procedure. Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Shouldice patients have said again and again, how much they enjoy the Shouldice experience. The average North American is gaining 1-2 lbs per year, and obesity is a clear risk factor in hernia recurrence. Somehow he would be entitled to weeks of paid leave with the hospital option due to healing times for their style of treatment whereas with the Shouldice option hed be back at work in a few days. I wonder if they know about him, or does he go into their success pile? We know that people often find it challenging to manage their weight, especially when they have a hernia that restricts their ability to exercise. The Republican lawmaker is scheduled t. 905-695-4967 * smah I had should ice give me the paperwork anyway and submitted it 2 times to my insurance and went thru an appeals process Finally I did get about a 60 percent payment back Think they got tired of me.. Haha. The trouble is he can barely walk with this baby between his legs. I can NOT for the life of me understand the following: You are correct though, there are not good studies comparing the two methods. We have just reviewed 400 consecutive patients from 4 years ago and our recurrence rate is 2%. 2015 surgeries (inguinal, umbilical) performed at local Ottawa hospital by general surgeon, with some specialization in hernia repair. Yes, some implants are great achievements like one of my friends who is 38 and got a pacemaker at 29, but I believe others have no place when they can be avoided with proper training. The food was good. I have seen these numbers elsewhere also. I have only good things to say about the Shouldice! TORONTO Shouldice Clinic Hernia Repair - August 2020 2,289 views Oct 22, 2020 27 Dislike Share Save Herve Del Norte 542 subscribers I provide a summary of my recent hernia repair surgery at the. Your kidding yourself trying to talk anyone into not going here for a repair Both the surgeons i had had well over 10000 repairs and the first one was nearing 30000. And while I agree with you on many of the double-standard, private taxing points surrounding Shouldice, I disagree that general surgery or mesh related surgery is in any way a better option. I had minimal bruising and swelling, and am mostly back to normal a few days after surgery. Im not a medical professional of any sort, but Im capable at measuring time the first two (father and neighbour), went to Shouldice and returned within 48 hours and their usual routines somewhat ecstatic about the result, and with no need to revisit the surgeries since. I had inguinal hernia repair at Shouldice in June 2017. Our first available appointment is in July of 2023. I hike a lot, mtn bike, lift >100# items, etc. Now I have chronic pain and wondering if I should of stuck out the pain another week or two to find another Dr. for another opinion. There are days I literally cannot walk. A skim off of the healthy and the wealthy to the private system, leaving the public system to deal with the emergency, unhealthy, and poorer patients. Since 1945, we have been gathering data from our follow-up examinations. I find it hard to get solid information of one method vs the other, maybe because there really isnt any. I know once Ive been opened up there is no going back. 80%| 10. Are you willing to be more specific about the nature of your problems post op? Sounds like you are doing a great job informing yourself about your options and the risks which is great to hear. I would even love to go there and observe their technique, but they are not in the business of educating surgeons, just skimming off our business. I went to see my family doctor as I live too far from Shouldice to visit. In any case my husbands case is exactly the kind of many complicationes hernia that you are talking about although all his many failed hernias and the fistula repair that involved having a large part of his bowl removed were done at major hospitals. I hope that is helpful. I am a 36 year old female (very slim and healthy) and hoping to start a family in the near future. Here, you can leave your busy schedule behind and enjoy a restful and relaxing recovery in fact, many people compare it to visiting a beautiful resort. I since switched meds and lost a bit of weight but Its so difficult to even move with a cantaloupe sized abdominal hernia. Sometimes this cost is paid out by private insurance companies if the patient has a health benefits plan, or by the patients themselves. We joked about standing by the front door and dropping our pjamas for the new intake. Based on my experience thus far, I would recommend Shouldice to those who are considering it. I have heard of one fellow returning to the gym and heavy squats within 2 months of his op which DOES seem to be tempting fate, so some patients may not be helping themselves. Poor nights sleep (roommate having pain, snoring, up through the night for pain meds, temperature check by nurse at some point, etc). I see that you are anti-Shouldice but wonder how much of that is based on procedure/method and how much is related to you not liking that they get to do only elective and cherry pick. My doctor wants me to lose 50 lbs and ive tried but I cant and I have never found diets to be successful. The recurrence rate with Shouldice techniques was higher than mesh techniques (OR 3.80, 95% CI 1.99 to 7.26) but lower than non-mesh techniques (OR 0.62, 95% CI 0.45 to 0.85). In the US though most general surgeons wont do it the old way or with disolveable meah for fear of reoccurance. may be involved. I have had this happen once. Most patients I know of that go to Shouldice go there specifically for the expert all-tissue repair, the classic old fashioned hernia repair sutured with their own tissues. I higly recommend Shouldice Hospital. A: The Shouldice repair is named after Dr. Edward Earle Shouldice (1890-1965), the Canadian surgeon who invented the technique in the 1940s. 7) Its difficult (not impossible) to find anything negative written about peoples experiences at Shouldice its predominantly positive what they say/write. Unfortunately I believe their actual holistic approach was outdated sometime during the cold war. When staring down the prospect of putting a foreign substance in your body, as a patient you need to be treated with respect and provide knowledge and experience when asked. Over the past two decades this small 90-bed hospital has averaged 7,000 operations annually. In the USA most Drs wont even do a simple hernia repair without mesh even if youre ideal for a non mesh surgery. I have been refused appointments many times (non-hernia related), this is their prerogative, this is how they minimize their risks and headaches. Also, I find there is a lack of information on hernias in fertile women and how to treat. Now some of the Shouldice clinic patients come from out of country and should be paying forall of their carebut what this percentage is, I do not know. A: The Shouldice repair is named after Dr. Edward Earle Shouldice (1890-1965), the Canadian surgeon who invented the technique in the 1940s. Or it isnt the mesh itself so much as the insertion procedure? Maybe if its a simple small hernia, Shouldice is a good choice, but otherwise, too clandestine for healthcare. And yes, Shouldice cherrypicks their cases, perhaps because they can. Its location is the former estate of George McCullagh, a publisher who created The Globe and Mail newspaper in 1936. WOW. We go to physicians expecting a solution to a problem, expecting, sometimes, an unreasonable outcome, expecting physicians to be more than human, expecting them to always do the right thing. My recommendation for anyone 40 and under is to NOT get mesh. We are committed to recruiting and retaining the most talented people and are focussed on creating a workplace where people enjoy the challenge of their career, create and engage in best practices, and are treated with respect. Recovery done at home, pain meds prescribed, incisions very tidy, standard sutures, little to no swelling or bruising. A friend of mine had the mesh technique and it resulted in a tumour growth that was quite complicated to resolve. Hi, I am the diabetic obese patient with an abdominal hernia. Stop smoking for a least 2 weeks before your surgery. If I had an unhappy patient who did not want to have surgery with me again, I would refer them on for a second opinion. The Shouldice Clinic outside of Toronto, Canada has demonstrated extraordinary safety and durability with their technique. Pure tissue technique, according to yourself and other general surgeons, has the risk of recurrence. In summary, I have to agree with lesmcc1: the technique, the hospital/facility itself, the four day stay, the old equipment, i.e., bed, the wound closure method, etc, all point to a we have always done it this way mindset. I think is a matter of profit from this industry. Toronto Transit. The staff were unfailingly courteous, even when under all-out attack by the annoying. The mesh industry is too powerful and monopolize the medical society. Which must annoy surgeons who use only mesh). So Im going to outline some of my problems with the Shouldice clinic, which is held up around the world as a great Canadian healthcare success story. Create a free website or blog at WordPress.com. minutes at a time, several times a day during the first few days after surgery If you are unable to have a bowel movement following surgery, a mild laxative such as Milk of . Just returned from Shouldice. Found a surgeon in Sarasota, Florida who does non-mesh hernia repairs (Shouldice). Polypropylene can cause many issues later on down the road research is finding and for those of us with mesh it could be a time bomb waiting to go off. 5 weeks after surgery, my scar looks pretty much healed and I expect it will fade with time. I dont want to come off too confrontational but I am going to be blunt. But my main problem with this approach as a taxpayer is that this is a huge waste of healthcare dollars. I discuss chronic pain issues with patients before surgery and try and make sure the nerves are away from the repair. And If I wasnt beginning to suffer the effects of cabin fever, and didnt have a life to get back to, I was almost sorry to leave to return to the UK. (thats gotta mean something!). You may be regret waiting some but better to wait an added week or month than have chronic pain as I do. From what research Ive done some say physical therapy helps. Very interesting and enlightening article for a soon-to-be operated-on groin-hernia sufferer like me. Or is it because, here it comes, that dangerous phrase Weve always done it this way? We have a big number here, dont you think? Its certainly an interesting place. Our first available appointment is in July of 2023. Chronic disabling pain which needs ongoing pain medication and/or other management (including mesh removal in the most severe cases) is thankfully extremely rare after groin hernia repair, be it with or without mesh. Shouldice I learned the name even before it had become personally relevant and noted it. I had two hernias repaired in November last year. I would love to see some frequency distributions for Shouldice repairs vs inpatient time and time back to work. But the reality is that in Ontario anyway, major hospitals are getting as bad as any private clinic in letting cost considerations trump quality of patient care, but thats a whole other topic. The office staff takes care of business very nicely, very personable, walking you through every step of the way. They dont call it the Shouldice Experience for nothing. I do everything I want without restricting myself. I know Shouldice will also cost me more than getting the mesh procedure done in-network here in the US but I feel that at least Ill be giving myself a chance of not exposing myself to a permanently inserted foregin object. colonel frank o'sullivan interview; beverly hills high school football Hes certainly not done growing. I have had direct experience with Shouldice where my husband had a large abdominal hernia repair and they did use mesh and the head surgeon gave a long history of their use of mesh at one of our appoinments. 7750 Bayview Avenue, Thornhill, Ontario. I always tell patients it takes as long as it takes to do a safe operation. Hilton Garden Inn300 Commerce Valley DriveThornhill, ON L3T 7X3905-709-60083 miles from the hospitalTo receive a 10% discounted Shouldice rate click here. I seem to be a good candidate for pure tissue. One might wonder why you could not find a surgeon in New York willing to do a repair without mesh- are all of these surgeons incompetent, immoral, or both? In this respect, mesh in the future could still have a place but as a last resort rather than the first thing the surgeon grabs! The amount of money being drained away by this clinic from the public system is opportunity cost, not just for hernia repairs, but all healthcare spending. I think I am going to stick with a repair by a general surgeon at my local hospital. It is virtually impossible to find any real data on Shouldice. Although operations are performed only five days a week, the remainder of the hospital is in operation continuously to attend to recovering patients. You dont know till you try it if it is going to help or not. Thanks for sharing your experience, Kram. Last week, the family that owns Shouldice Hospital announced that it would like to sell its facility to Centric Health, a for-profit company traded on the Toronto Stock Exchange.. Shouldice, a Southern Ontario facility renowned for its care of patients with hernias, was founded by a surgeon in the . Cataract implants, joint implants, tubal ligation clips are all examples of other extremely safe foreign materials we implant in patients for their benefit. and then he has the audacity to tell me that I cant feel the mesh and that the pain is also in my head. Your post here changed my life, my plans, in a good very good way. I traveled from NY TRYING TO AVOID the horrors of the mesh repairs. Shouldice specializes in this unique approach to hernia repair. 14 Weeks with mesh. My room mate (who had 10) yelped a few times, but he didnt strike me as a complainer. Length of stay is ridiculous not to mention the Bill for said stay Did I have any discomfort during recovery? I would have to see why, based on outcomes & diversity of treatments required, doctors/surgeons should have common requirements for their practice. my time at portia how to turn in commission; scholl canyon scorecard; westin savannah gift shop; fashion journalism schools in new york; windows 11 start menu all apps default; avelia liberty travel time; burial laws california; there there powwow summary; Menu. ( I know I already said that but they were really that bad). When needed, a hernia weight loss diet is individualized for each . Another confession, I alsomake money doing hernia repairs, but I dont make nearly as much as the Shouldice does off their patients. The hospital also. I suspect looking into that would be very difficult indeed. If I was doing only one operation, the only thing I would be is bored. Hernia repairs can be done without a general anesthetic at other locations as well- I routinely do mine without a GA. Princess of Wales Theatre Royal Alexandra Theatre CAA Ed Mirvish TheatreCAA Theatre, 7750 Bayview Avenue,Thornhill, Ontario,Canada L3T 4A3View Map, Tel: 905-889-1125 Fax: 905-889-4216 Canada: 1-800-291-7750 U.S./International: 1-855-328-3423 postoffice@shouldice.com, Shouldice Hospital is committed to excellence in serving all patients including people with disabilities.Learn More. Lot of disparity in the anecdotal evidence (my understanding has been that in at least once instance a patient was offered a days long recovery at Shouldice vs weeks long at a hospital, and that has been constant with my knowledge of their reputation in general). Odds are, I am going to be the one digging out a blocked or gangrenous piece of bowel from this hernia in the middle of the night if I do not fix it electively. You . 8. My husband went in, doctor said lose weight and i will do it. In addition, in my case Im 41 and 168 lbs. shouldice clinic wait times. But I wonder if I will be told I need to have mesh after all. You can travel with a hernia as long as its been 3 months since you were seen for it. Meaning the hernia comes back, requiring a second repair. Hi. He went to a top medical school and top intern in residency program. All patients will be actively screened at the front door. My husband was asked to lose weight for the surgery but still was not skinny. Once youre admitted to the hospital, youll meet other hernia patients. Ive read of issues with all repair methods except for TAPP laproscopic have you heard of it? Is this because Shouldice thinks this is good care? MeSH terms Adolescent Adult Age Factors That is why Im looking at surgery but here in the US my surgeon says mesh is the only option and that he will be using a medium (as opposed to ultra light) mesh with plenty of overlap to repair the hernia. . This makes any numbers they publish about their recurrence rates completely out of touch with the reality of what myself and other general surgeons are dealing with in our practices. Various proposals are set forth for expanding the capacity of the hospital. Standard and mandatory wake up is 0530 for all. Suppose you had a recurrence after a tissue repair. As a specialist, I am not allowed tobill OHIP to seepatients without a referral from another doctor, and so we see the double standard growing. Our current career opportunities are outlined below. Ive had this hernia since I gave birth to my child 9 years ago and my life has been very bad since. I had my first one done at Shouldice (10 yrs ago) and no issues with it unless I do a lot of hiking or lifting and then maybe a bit of soreness in the left groin. Update been 8 months out and little to no change in the pain and other complications. Please mention Shouldice Hospital when you make your reservations. The Shouldice clinic is a good example of that. Snorers were a problem for one or two, so much so for one patient that he got himself moved, but most of us did not have that problem. I am quite sore, I am bruised from my left hip bone to my scrotum including everything in between. That would depend on what age the first repair was done, the time since the first repair, and the BMI and other health factors (such as smoking) of the patient with the recurrence. I would love to see their numbers as well, but that is unlikely to happen soon. Surgical Wait Times Diagnostic Imaging Wait Times (CT and MRI) Ontario Health is an institution under the Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act, 1990 (FIPPA), and has policies, procedures and practices in place to ensure that its collection, use and disclosure of personal information is in accordance with FIPPA. Sorry your husband had such a tough time with his hernia, hope he is doing well now. Shouldice Hospital recommends a healthy diet for hernia repair, and one that focuses on achieving an acceptable body weight. Is my scar larger than it could have been with a mesh repair? I am quite disappointed in myself for not having done a thorough investigation prior to my Shouldice fix. Hernias do just get larger, and there is also the issue of not being able to travel if you dont get it fixed (pre-exisiting condition). I think 3 or 4 tomorrow in fact. I hear that the wait time is up to a few years for the surgery itself. I asked multiple times to my surgeon prior to the operation on chronic pain and other complications. The literature on incisional hernias is where the use of mesh was first tested. I agree with Toronto that it is hard to find any real data on the Shouldice clinic. Possibly related to how much private insurance you carry. So why would you do so for an inguinal hernia repair, a surgery that is far from simple and fraught with potential serious complications, mesh or no mesh. I have had a similar issue with the mesh (surgery May 2017) and tried a nerve block. Toronto Transit. There are many companies which manufacture mesh (hundreds) and yes they like to make money. Do you have any other suggestions for me? He did get a cyst in his rear about 2 1/2 years ago, the surgeon offered to take a look. shouldice clinic wait times. The standard of care when the Shouldice was formed was a primary (suture) repair and lots of days in hospital recovering from the pain of having your own tissues reamed together to repair the hernia. Tickets cost $4 and the journey takes 38 min. Which method is the best option considering I want to get pregnant? People seem to either love it or hate it. I will continue to recommend the Shouldice and feel it was the right choice for me. Leave jewellery and other valuables at home. 1/2-5/8 of flesh mounded above the underlying muscular tissue fix. Success is defined by the patient as as good as new and somewhat differently by many surgeons, who would probably view that as unrealistic I am absolutely NOT suggesting a conspiracy but why mesh can be a problem is still not well understood. My luck, the guy was a heavy sleeper and snored all night which means I could not get that much sleep during my stay. To me, mesh is the risk here, not hernia recurrence with pure tissue. Food was above what was expected of hospital food. Have you or your staff followed up with all your patients? I also have not had good outcomes with the medical community. So you are absolutely right, there should be requirements for all surgeons and health care providers to follow evidence based medicine and try and make patients better. Anecdotal reports from those who have had this problem make it sound like a real living hell. We offer a complete and holistic recovery program that promotes healing and a rapid return to normal activities. I may get the same answers but at least Ive tried. My hernias were small (umbilical and femoral) and related to pregnancies and not a previous incision. The washroom is our room was sporting a nearly unbearable urine smell. We now have detailed records on more than 400,000 patients and maintain one of the most comprehensive database on hernia repair in the world. I have a rather large incisional hernia and am considering a trip to Shouldice. Complications after a mesh surgery can drive the cost of a simple hernia repair into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. I am debating on having surgery on my right inguinal hernia and whether to do it at Shouldice or at my local hospital. Same nurse. Shouldice patients frequen6tly return to work in a few days; the average total time off is eight days. Too risky. If hernia repair is right for you, well set a hospital admission date that is convenient for your schedule. The staples are removed (one half at a time) over the two following days. Large ventral/incisional hernia repair or complex abdominal wall reconstruction- different story. The benefits of mesh far outweigh the risks for the vast majority of adult hernia patients. 00%| | Expected . 2. shouldice offers low cost. my surgeon said it was mostly a bunch of people complaining looking for money. Critiques are always welcome because it can make people think out of the box. A lot of nerve damage occurred to my femoral nerve, and the mesh they have inserted is extremely painful. To do less would be to jeopardize the positive end result. Comments Off on shouldice clinic wait times; June 9, 2022; The sheet says this ridge will last for several months (oh joy). Shouldice Hospital is returning to Vancouver to conduct examinations in March 2023! Realistically, I am 50, 57 and 163 pounds, am I really going to lose 30 pounds and keep it off for the rest of my life? Just curious. Is the mesh currently being used the same product that has been on the Toronto news where they move around internally after coming loose? If you are unable to submit this document in advance, you will be asked to complete it upon arrival at the clinic. You, and others like you, in other words. State/public schools teach who theyre told to teach meaning everyone else who doesnt get to go to the private schools. Our registered dietitian will develop a personalized weight loss program for you and show you how to make healthy food and exercise choices. I know 2 other people who have gone up for repair both of which are now well over 30 years on the repair without issue also.. Take care safe travels. Thank you for this post.
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